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	<title>Comments on: Nick Griffin&#8217;s day out</title>
	<atom:link href="http://sarahditum.com/2009/10/23/nick-griffins-day-out/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://sarahditum.com/2009/10/23/nick-griffins-day-out/</link>
	<description>Freelance writer and journalist</description>
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		<title>By: Lawrie</title>
		<link>http://sarahditum.com/2009/10/23/nick-griffins-day-out/#comment-1934</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Lawrie]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 05 Nov 2009 10:56:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://sarahditum.com/?p=2681#comment-1934</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[&lt;i&gt;&quot;it is easy to be a “competent speaker” when you have rehearsed every line as most of the panel and audience had obviously done&quot;&lt;/i&gt;

Even the &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.guardian.co.uk/media/mediamonkeyblog/2009/oct/26/question-time-daily-mail-nick-griffin&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Daily Mail&#039;s photoshopped version of the audience hand-out for Question Time&lt;/a&gt; says &quot;write your question on the card&quot;. Y&#039;know, so you&#039;ll be prepared to ask it. Preparing for what you&#039;re going to say in a national televised public debate isn&#039;t everyone ganging up on Nick Griffin - it&#039;s Public Speaking 101. A class that Griffin apparently didn&#039;t attend.

And since you bring up sidestepping, I enjoy the way that you take Sarah&#039;s comment about Griffin being racist and simply turn around, levelling the same accusation at &#039;ethnic minorities&#039; rather than tackle it at all. It&#039;s really not &#039;us vs. them&#039; because there is no &#039;us&#039; and there is no &#039;them&#039;.

It also seems implicit in your statement that it&#039;s okay for Nick Griffin to be racist to everyone who isn&#039;t white, because they&#039;re racist back. Unfortunately for this argument, Nick Griffin isn&#039;t five years old, and this isn&#039;t the playground.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><i>&#8220;it is easy to be a “competent speaker” when you have rehearsed every line as most of the panel and audience had obviously done&#8221;</i></p>
<p>Even the <a href="http://www.guardian.co.uk/media/mediamonkeyblog/2009/oct/26/question-time-daily-mail-nick-griffin" rel="nofollow">Daily Mail&#8217;s photoshopped version of the audience hand-out for Question Time</a> says &#8220;write your question on the card&#8221;. Y&#8217;know, so you&#8217;ll be prepared to ask it. Preparing for what you&#8217;re going to say in a national televised public debate isn&#8217;t everyone ganging up on Nick Griffin &#8211; it&#8217;s Public Speaking 101. A class that Griffin apparently didn&#8217;t attend.</p>
<p>And since you bring up sidestepping, I enjoy the way that you take Sarah&#8217;s comment about Griffin being racist and simply turn around, levelling the same accusation at &#8216;ethnic minorities&#8217; rather than tackle it at all. It&#8217;s really not &#8216;us vs. them&#8217; because there is no &#8216;us&#8217; and there is no &#8216;them&#8217;.</p>
<p>It also seems implicit in your statement that it&#8217;s okay for Nick Griffin to be racist to everyone who isn&#8217;t white, because they&#8217;re racist back. Unfortunately for this argument, Nick Griffin isn&#8217;t five years old, and this isn&#8217;t the playground.</p>
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		<title>By: Sarah</title>
		<link>http://sarahditum.com/2009/10/23/nick-griffins-day-out/#comment-1933</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Sarah]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 04 Nov 2009 20:50:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://sarahditum.com/?p=2681#comment-1933</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[That &quot;both ways&quot; talking point assumes that only two racial groupings count: &quot;white&quot; and &quot;everyone else&quot;, which is the faulty logic of the white racist. There are pretty much endless permutations of prejudice against arbitrarily defined ethnic groups. None of them justify any of the others.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>That &#8220;both ways&#8221; talking point assumes that only two racial groupings count: &#8220;white&#8221; and &#8220;everyone else&#8221;, which is the faulty logic of the white racist. There are pretty much endless permutations of prejudice against arbitrarily defined ethnic groups. None of them justify any of the others.</p>
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		<title>By: Toni</title>
		<link>http://sarahditum.com/2009/10/23/nick-griffins-day-out/#comment-1932</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Toni]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 04 Nov 2009 17:36:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://sarahditum.com/?p=2681#comment-1932</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[&#039;red-faced chap in a lemon-yellow jumper&#039;

Nice line - can I use it in a poem or a piece of FICTION?!  - anyway it is easy to be a &quot;competent speaker&quot; when you have rehearsed every line as most of the panel and audience had obviously done - a point you neatly sidestepped.

As for &quot;obviously racist&quot; - racism works both ways and there is plenty of racism (both overt and covert) towards white people by ethnic minorities.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8216;red-faced chap in a lemon-yellow jumper&#8217;</p>
<p>Nice line &#8211; can I use it in a poem or a piece of FICTION?!  &#8211; anyway it is easy to be a &#8220;competent speaker&#8221; when you have rehearsed every line as most of the panel and audience had obviously done &#8211; a point you neatly sidestepped.</p>
<p>As for &#8220;obviously racist&#8221; &#8211; racism works both ways and there is plenty of racism (both overt and covert) towards white people by ethnic minorities.</p>
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		<title>By: Sarah</title>
		<link>http://sarahditum.com/2009/10/23/nick-griffins-day-out/#comment-1930</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Sarah]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 04 Nov 2009 15:52:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://sarahditum.com/?p=2681#comment-1930</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Griffin had supporters in there - he got the odd light smattering of applause, and there was even a sympathetic question from a red-faced chap in a lemon-yellow jumper. I&#039;d guess that, if anything, BNP supporters were slightly over-represented that evening, given they (you?) only got 6% of the vote. So there were plenty of illiberal twats there too. It&#039;s just that Griffin is an incompetent speaker and &lt;i&gt;obviously racist&lt;/i&gt;, neither of which are popular characteristics in a politician.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Griffin had supporters in there &#8211; he got the odd light smattering of applause, and there was even a sympathetic question from a red-faced chap in a lemon-yellow jumper. I&#8217;d guess that, if anything, BNP supporters were slightly over-represented that evening, given they (you?) only got 6% of the vote. So there were plenty of illiberal twats there too. It&#8217;s just that Griffin is an incompetent speaker and <i>obviously racist</i>, neither of which are popular characteristics in a politician.</p>
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		<title>By: Toni</title>
		<link>http://sarahditum.com/2009/10/23/nick-griffins-day-out/#comment-1929</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Toni]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 04 Nov 2009 14:05:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://sarahditum.com/?p=2681#comment-1929</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[The whole event was stage managed and played out in front of a studio audience of well rehearsed liberal twats. Nobody would be at their best in front of such organised hostility.
The country is overrun with mass immigration and Labour refuses to even admit that this was a deliberate policy and Lib/Con refuse to do anything about it - go figure!]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The whole event was stage managed and played out in front of a studio audience of well rehearsed liberal twats. Nobody would be at their best in front of such organised hostility.<br />
The country is overrun with mass immigration and Labour refuses to even admit that this was a deliberate policy and Lib/Con refuse to do anything about it &#8211; go figure!</p>
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		<title>By: Lawrie</title>
		<link>http://sarahditum.com/2009/10/23/nick-griffins-day-out/#comment-1862</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Lawrie]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 23 Oct 2009 13:52:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://sarahditum.com/?p=2681#comment-1862</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Trying as best we can to ignore Griffin&#039;s statements today about London being &quot;ethnically cleansed&quot; of &#039;indigenous&#039; Britons (because, y&#039;know, many races living together in the same city is the same as the Holocaust that apparently didn&#039;t happen); his main point of contention was that it wasn&#039;t a &#039;proper&#039; Question Time because all the questions were about BNP policies and beliefs.

Question Time is a panel of politicians debating current issues most present in the public consciousness. Inarguably two of the biggest news stories over the past couple of weeks have been Jan Moir&#039;s crash course in distance-forensics and Nick Griffin&#039;s appearance on QT. Both of these were discussed at length.

This, Nick, is pretty much the definition of a self-fulfilling prophecy: you became the news of the day, appearing on a topical discussion programme about the news of the day. You clearly revelled in the attention it garnered your party leading up to the event, and then, because you had a particularly bad outing, cried foul.

Did you honestly expect it go like this?

&lt;b&gt;Dimbleby:&lt;/b&gt; Nick Griffin, where do you stand on civil partnerships?
&lt;b&gt;Griffin:&lt;/b&gt; I think homosexuals are creepy.
&lt;b&gt;Dimbleby:&lt;/b&gt; Very good. Next question?]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Trying as best we can to ignore Griffin&#8217;s statements today about London being &#8220;ethnically cleansed&#8221; of &#8216;indigenous&#8217; Britons (because, y&#8217;know, many races living together in the same city is the same as the Holocaust that apparently didn&#8217;t happen); his main point of contention was that it wasn&#8217;t a &#8216;proper&#8217; Question Time because all the questions were about BNP policies and beliefs.</p>
<p>Question Time is a panel of politicians debating current issues most present in the public consciousness. Inarguably two of the biggest news stories over the past couple of weeks have been Jan Moir&#8217;s crash course in distance-forensics and Nick Griffin&#8217;s appearance on QT. Both of these were discussed at length.</p>
<p>This, Nick, is pretty much the definition of a self-fulfilling prophecy: you became the news of the day, appearing on a topical discussion programme about the news of the day. You clearly revelled in the attention it garnered your party leading up to the event, and then, because you had a particularly bad outing, cried foul.</p>
<p>Did you honestly expect it go like this?</p>
<p><b>Dimbleby:</b> Nick Griffin, where do you stand on civil partnerships?<br />
<b>Griffin:</b> I think homosexuals are creepy.<br />
<b>Dimbleby:</b> Very good. Next question?</p>
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		<title>By: Jesus Chris</title>
		<link>http://sarahditum.com/2009/10/23/nick-griffins-day-out/#comment-1861</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Jesus Chris]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 23 Oct 2009 12:24:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://sarahditum.com/?p=2681#comment-1861</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Except that&#039;s not true about the members - the site was completely down for all interactive content before, during and immediately after the show. Right now the secure site has no valid security certificate and so lets you sign up for a BNP blog account to comment on the blogs (for what it&#039;s worth, I also have one), not sign up for &#039;future membership&#039;. No such option was available then, and not now.

Also, fifteen million hits is, well, bollocks. &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.alexa.com/siteinfo/http%3A%2F%2Fbnp.org.uk&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Alexa rankings show them pushing on an increase these past few days&lt;/a&gt;, but nothing like the 15m they claim. That rate, pushed them up to 10,000, that&#039;s more than 25,000 unique hits, but if they were heading for 15m unique hits then that would have made them as popular as the BBC. On average, visitors are down, page bounce is well up, time on site is down and search engine referrals are down.

As you rightly pointed out, the number of hits doesn&#039;t gauge how popular a site is in good terms - only how much it&#039;s getting mentioned. 

I got the episode, by the way. The format was annoying and Griffin-centric, although that may have been down to the fact that everyone wanted to ask him something. Even those who could be construed to be BNP supporters were asking him BNP related questions. Everyone contributed to it, so it wasn&#039;t a gang-bang in that sense because even the BNP would see that it&#039;s dumb to get their man in that position and then ask Chris Huhne about what the Libs would do with prisons. 

Griffin failed because his answers were twattish. I was glad to see that he &lt;i&gt;did&lt;/i&gt; get into a little rant. I get the feeling that once the dam broke and he went on about leftist conspiracies and the rest, he knew he was fucked and was kicking himself for being goaded on it - hence the hand-wringing, shaking.

Straw was a failure on his own part. He looked just as nervous and out of place as Griffin did, and to be honest, he was shown up on immigration - which should have been the most researched point on his notes - with his lack of valid response.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Except that&#8217;s not true about the members &#8211; the site was completely down for all interactive content before, during and immediately after the show. Right now the secure site has no valid security certificate and so lets you sign up for a BNP blog account to comment on the blogs (for what it&#8217;s worth, I also have one), not sign up for &#8216;future membership&#8217;. No such option was available then, and not now.</p>
<p>Also, fifteen million hits is, well, bollocks. <a href="http://www.alexa.com/siteinfo/http%3A%2F%2Fbnp.org.uk" rel="nofollow">Alexa rankings show them pushing on an increase these past few days</a>, but nothing like the 15m they claim. That rate, pushed them up to 10,000, that&#8217;s more than 25,000 unique hits, but if they were heading for 15m unique hits then that would have made them as popular as the BBC. On average, visitors are down, page bounce is well up, time on site is down and search engine referrals are down.</p>
<p>As you rightly pointed out, the number of hits doesn&#8217;t gauge how popular a site is in good terms &#8211; only how much it&#8217;s getting mentioned. </p>
<p>I got the episode, by the way. The format was annoying and Griffin-centric, although that may have been down to the fact that everyone wanted to ask him something. Even those who could be construed to be BNP supporters were asking him BNP related questions. Everyone contributed to it, so it wasn&#8217;t a gang-bang in that sense because even the BNP would see that it&#8217;s dumb to get their man in that position and then ask Chris Huhne about what the Libs would do with prisons. </p>
<p>Griffin failed because his answers were twattish. I was glad to see that he <i>did</i> get into a little rant. I get the feeling that once the dam broke and he went on about leftist conspiracies and the rest, he knew he was fucked and was kicking himself for being goaded on it &#8211; hence the hand-wringing, shaking.</p>
<p>Straw was a failure on his own part. He looked just as nervous and out of place as Griffin did, and to be honest, he was shown up on immigration &#8211; which should have been the most researched point on his notes &#8211; with his lack of valid response.</p>
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		<title>By: Steve</title>
		<link>http://sarahditum.com/2009/10/23/nick-griffins-day-out/#comment-1859</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Steve]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 23 Oct 2009 11:18:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://sarahditum.com/?p=2681#comment-1859</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[The best thing about this is that, while the panel were hardly sharp shooters, he did really make himself look like a tit. &quot;I don&#039;t know why I&#039;ve changed my mind&quot; - lovely. I&#039;m glad he was on: anybody who believes that crap can go with him. Maybe someone should have establishd that if he took his million voters that would help the immigration problem he sees

i agree with the point above about over liberalisation though: the truth is that to simply heckle does not refute his claims (and however vile these need refutation)]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The best thing about this is that, while the panel were hardly sharp shooters, he did really make himself look like a tit. &#8220;I don&#8217;t know why I&#8217;ve changed my mind&#8221; &#8211; lovely. I&#8217;m glad he was on: anybody who believes that crap can go with him. Maybe someone should have establishd that if he took his million voters that would help the immigration problem he sees</p>
<p>i agree with the point above about over liberalisation though: the truth is that to simply heckle does not refute his claims (and however vile these need refutation)</p>
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		<title>By: Sarah</title>
		<link>http://sarahditum.com/2009/10/23/nick-griffins-day-out/#comment-1858</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Sarah]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 23 Oct 2009 09:46:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://sarahditum.com/?p=2681#comment-1858</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[What Jack Straw should have said: &quot;If Griffin wants to live as a dispossessed aboriginal in the UK, I will personally take away his children, expel him from his home and send him a bottle of meths a day to support his despairing alcoholism.&quot;]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>What Jack Straw should have said: &#8220;If Griffin wants to live as a dispossessed aboriginal in the UK, I will personally take away his children, expel him from his home and send him a bottle of meths a day to support his despairing alcoholism.&#8221;</p>
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		<title>By: Joel</title>
		<link>http://sarahditum.com/2009/10/23/nick-griffins-day-out/#comment-1856</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Joel]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 23 Oct 2009 09:37:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://sarahditum.com/?p=2681#comment-1856</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I thought it was a bit of a big old mess.

I&#039;m sure all the students in the audience who&#039;d read the Indy&#039;s &#039;10 Reasons The BNP Are Arseholes&#039; that morning felt great about calling Griffin a scumbag and applauding each other, but I can&#039;t see that they&#039;ll have swayed away anyone who was thinking about voting for him. Meanwhile, Griffin did manage to crowbar in a few points that seemed superficially plausible (indigenous people, etc), and nobody bothered to take issue with his logical failings because they&#039;d all come with their notes ready-prepared. :(]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I thought it was a bit of a big old mess.</p>
<p>I&#8217;m sure all the students in the audience who&#8217;d read the Indy&#8217;s &#8217;10 Reasons The BNP Are Arseholes&#8217; that morning felt great about calling Griffin a scumbag and applauding each other, but I can&#8217;t see that they&#8217;ll have swayed away anyone who was thinking about voting for him. Meanwhile, Griffin did manage to crowbar in a few points that seemed superficially plausible (indigenous people, etc), and nobody bothered to take issue with his logical failings because they&#8217;d all come with their notes ready-prepared. :(</p>
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